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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, I'm new to this forum and relatively new to muzzleloader hunting. I bought a T/C Triumph last year and had excellent luck with both the gun and hunting last year. This year I went to the range to make sure the gun was sighted in and it's printing holes all over the place. I hadn't changed a thing as after my hunting last year I cleaned the gun and applied bore butter for storage and cleaned the barrel before loading and shooting. Using the same loads and same everything it will sometimes group two shots and the next two, three or four shots will be 6' high, low, left or right. Shot around 15 to 20 shots and I'm at a loss and frustrated as I'm booked for a Kansas hunt at the end of September. Any suggestions?
 
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try brand new powder or pellets. which and what type are you shooting? a friend of mine had that problem with the lose pyrodex and he just needed a new batch. then right back in there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Well that's one thing I didn't try yet. I just got a new batch as I was running low on the original batch.Hope to get to the range this coming week.
 

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I use the shockwaves too..

Maybe the powder will fix it. The bullet is seating in the same spot each time right? If it is I dont know. You seem like your keeping it clean. Are you swabbing the barrell between shots? Im just throwing ideas out there that maybe you havent thought of. Hopefully we can figure it out.
 
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check all the screws as well but i'll bet its the powder but only 25 cents. and welcome to the forum. as you may have noticed there is no lack of sharing opinions and thoughts. jump in anywhere anytime.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Thanks for the Welcome! Yes I'm swabbing the barrel between shots.....in fact I wonder if I'm over doing it if that's possible. I'm kinda of anal to having a clean barrel between shots as last year I was doing that with tremendous results. It's probably the the gun but I was impressed so I didn't want to change a thing. I did check all the screws on the scope mounts and base and things seem good there. I did notice a tiny bit of play on the hinge area between the barrel and the rear of the gun when broke open, but again it was so negligible that it could be nothing. I tightened the one screw about one full turn and the other was tight. I hope the powder will fix it.
 

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I'll add the same welcome. I don't have much to add on the shoot-in problem as I don't use pellets. My TC firehawk wont shoot them as only one pellet goes off. I assume that your on a good solid rest with no foward hand pressure torking the stock. You are probably correct on the over cleaning especially if you use any kind of liquid between shots that might partially wet a pellet. I run a copper brush after two shots then shoot two more ect. Otherwise, everyone else has pretty much covered it. Good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I'll add the same welcome. I'll don't have much to add on the shoot-in problem as I don't use pellets. My TC firehawk wont shoot them as only one pellet goes off. I assume that your on a good solid rest with no foward hand pressure torking the stock. You are probably correct on the over cleaning especially if you use any kind of liquid between shots that might partially wet a pellet. I run a copper brush after two shots then shoot two more ect. Otherwise, everyone else has pretty much covered it. Good luck!
I do use wet patches but follow up with dry ones until the the dry ones come out clean but maybe there's moisture left on the face of the breech. I'll check that next time. I'm fairly confident with my shooting rest (sand bags) and position as I don't think I changed any of that from last year.
Thanks again Hunting Man for the welcome.
 

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welcome to the site.are you using a scope?maybe it or the sights got banged up without you noticing it.i never clean between shots till after 6.try the new powder and get back to us
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
welcome to the site.are you using a scope?maybe it or the sights got banged up without you noticing it.i never clean between shots till after 6.try the new powder and get back to us
Yup, using the Nikon 3x9 that T/C kinda recommends for their Triumph model. Since the gun doesn't group I figured something was loose. I just assumed if the scope took a whack it should at least group where it was knocked off but one never knows! I will start with the new powder and if that doesn't straighten things out I will try cleaning less and try some other suggestions mentioned. Thanks.
 

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If as you stated your shots are 6' (6" ??) off at times something is drastically wrong. You have a 209 primer with 2-50gr pellets followed by a bullet/sabot combination seated the same eact time? I would swap scopes borrow one if possible or purchase a 39.99 bushnell mount it and try to sight in using new pellets primers and the same bullets as last year. Start at 25 yds with a 3X3 sheet of cardboard. If you can't get the gun to sight-in send it back and explain the problem to TC and the timetable you need it back for. If the gun does sight-in with another scope send the Nikon in for repairs. This is the second problem with triumph/Nikon combinations, maybe a trend starting.:crazy:
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
If as you stated your shots are 6' (6" ??) off at times something is drastically wrong. You have a 209 primer with 2-50gr pellets followed by a bullet/sabot combination seated the same eact time? I would swap scopes borrow one if possible or purchase a 39.99 bushnell mount it and try to sight in using new pellets primers and the same bullets as last year. Start at 25 yds with a 3X3 sheet of cardboard. If you can't get the gun to sight-in send it back and explain the problem to TC and the timetable you need it back for. If the gun does sight-in with another scope send the Nikon in for repairs. This is the second problem with triumph/Nikon combinations, maybe a trend starting.:crazy:
Wow, my bad! In my opening thread I screwed up big time and you caught it. I meant 6" not 6'. Anyway, 6" to the left and 6" to the right and you have a foot wide P.O.I. zone. At this rate I'm hitting paper plates at 100 yards but barely......not good enough for me. I will work or my seating/cleaning and try new powder and then try a different scope if everything else fails.
 

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As Ron stated I'll bet it is the powder. I once had the same problem. You really once opening the box need to reseal them in a vacuum sealer bag with one of those moister bags in with them. Also check the sabots. It is well known in the industry that there is sometimes a consistency problem with some manufacturers. Let us know how it turns out.:rolleyes:
 

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I shoot the same loads from my Omega. Work out the variables. Here are my polly pointers. A new muzzleloading takes around 60 -75 shots to get broken in before you start seeing consistent groups.

1. Ensure your primers are designed for in lines and not the std Winchester shotgun 209 primers (bluebox). These primers are to powerful for in lines and cause inconsistent burn rates.

2. Be careful when seating the bullet on the pellets. You may be crunching them. Push the bullet down and just lean into the ram rod a little with your weight to seat the bullet against the charge. Don't smash it down like a piston. If you haven't done so buy the handle accessory that screws on the end of the 10/32 threads. Use a spin jag to load as it will align the sabot to your rifling.

3. Keep your pellets dry. They are extremely hydroscopic Any moisture will make them shoot different.

4. Cleaning: Be consistent. 2-3 wet patches between each shot then use the retriever from max muzzloading to get the plastic out of the rifling and follow up with a dry patch or 2.

5. Try changing to T7 powder (90-120 gr) for increased accuracy. 2-50 gr pellets may not be the sweet spot on your Triumph. There is alot of variation within the same box of pellets. You get what you get in a box of pellets

6. Reference the 2 websites below for additional info. Buy Russell Lynch's video's if you are truly on a quest for muzzleloader accuracy.
MAX: Muzzleloader Accuracy Xperts
SpinJag - The 2-in-1 Jag For Muzzleloaders
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Well, looks like you fellows helped me get on to something. I tried a new box of Triple Seven today along with not "over cleaning" and trying to seat the sabot and lead differently. At 100 yds, the first shot was low and left by 2" the next 2 shots were high and left by 1.5". The cool part was the last 2 were touching each other. Thinking (and hoping) the gun was starting to group I adjusted the scope and the next shot centered the bull.:biggrin: I had one bullet left and shot that and it was 1.5" low and left but still touching the black bull. I am using Winchester shotgun primers and I will get some inline primers along with more lead and get back to the range to fine tune. Thing are sure looking up thanks to everyone's help. Stay tuned.
 
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that change could be from all the other little tweaks you did. sounds like your back on track. either vacum seal it each year or just get new stuff and shoot up the old.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
that change could be from all the other little tweaks you did. sounds like your back on track. either vacum seal it each year or just get new stuff and shoot up the old.
I'll definitely take that into consideration for end of season and next. For now, I still want to keep tweaking now to find the "sweet spot" on this gun before hunting season.
 

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good to see things back to more normal. As stated just fine tuning now with consistant loadings. That 6' did scare me!:surprised:
 
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