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I am so excited about getting out in the timber with the kids for the first time this year. Both of my children have decided to hunt, so I bought a youth model 243 last year and we have been shooting it a lot the last couple of weeks...(they are better shots than I am) haha As a 20+ year bow hunter this is a new game for me. We are talking about 100 yard shots and a new mind set. They have grown up with me watching the Outdoor channel and loading the dvd player with big bucks videos instead of Disney stuff. They told me they wouldn't shoot a small buck.... it has to be a mature deer or they would just shoot a doe. I didn't come to that conclusion without first a few small racked, less than mature deer in the freezer. I saw a post with the question asking why people shot small bucks instead of does with loose tag limits. Are we setting their goals too high for new hunters? They see the BIG BUCKS they take on TV and it is not to often they talk about management bucks, or show them taking does. When it comes to freezer meat we all know what taste better..... I think this is a great site with great information, and the more I talk to new hunters, the more concerned I get that we are not helping out the new people that want to take part in this sport. Do you have any information on starting a hunting club so we can share our ideas and tips to the next generation of hunters? My daughter has been in some heated discussions with kids at school defending hunting and talking about doing it the right way. I want to help out. Let me know your thoughts. I just can't believe how excited I am for them to hunt. What a great feeling for Dad.
 

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Hey thats great that the kids are interested in hunting. Many are not mainly because they are too lazy these days. The hunting shows are good and bad IMO. Good because it gets many interested in hunting and they learn bits and pieces of info that can be usefull. Bad because it gives a false sence of reality. Nearly all shows end with a kill and we know thats rarely the case. Also many are shot on game ranches and not normal woods or farms. The solitude of sitting and waiting isnt enjoyable for long for many if sightings arent regular. I hunt in Florida. Not well known for its big deer. I could go to Georgia or Alabama but the economy has got me grounded to my home woods. I find a small spiral notebook journal helps to pass the time and is a good read later both for me and others. In before daylight and absolutely never climbing down before 10 is my usual plan. Ive found kids burn out easier in the morning than the evening where it seems to get more exiting near the end of the day. My daughter liked hunting but quit going about 14. Too much other stuff going on in her teenage life, so enjoy the moments while their still young and good luck.
 

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I have two daughters who will be hunting with me as well. Probably not this fall though they need a lot more practice shooting.However as the season is winding down I will get them out into the field with me just so they can get a feel for what happens while hunting for deer. I also agree with you on the outdoor shows they always take a great animal even if it is what they call a management buck.Both of my kids have watched these type of shows and it has been explained to them that these are proffesionally guided hunts on ranches that are sometimes fenced. I realize this makes for a great show and yes I get a thrill out of seeing big bucks on t.v.But as you said what is this doing for the sport of hunting? As hunters we need to bring more youth into the sport and bringing there hopes up with this type of programming is not to helpful.
 
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there is nothing wrong with shooting an immature buck as long as the reason to do so has been thought out. kids first deer, or anyone's first deer, meat for the freezer with limited time or tags. there are lots of good reason to do so. i just think "because it was standing there" isn't good enough and we all should strive to think about what we are doing out there for the "sport", the animal, and other hunters. someone said think about yourself and forget everyone else regardless of the harm that may be doing, thats just wrong thinking in my opinion. if we are going to get a kid or newbie into hunting they need to first understand all the reasons we hunt, tradition, management of the resource, food, ect. not just to kill stuff. again its the four stages of being a hunter.

oh and enjoy this time with your kids they do grow up so fast. then you're going what the heck happened to the time.
 

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I don't believe anyone should need a reason as to why they've shot a Legal Buck.
Immature bucks are just as legal as mature bucks and that's what our youth hunters should be being taught.
 

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Do you have any information on starting a hunting club so we can share our ideas and tips to the next generation of hunters?
This site can be a help for any youth hunter out there. I want those kids on here reading posts from the older mature hunters that frequent this forum daily. Good learning tool in my book. The young hunters or potential young hunters on here is the reason we run such a strick language guideline. If my parents didnt let me say it when I was little we will edit it out here. No fault to the poster just would rather not kids read it if their not suppose to say it.

A young hunter thing that is being done locally here is a "Youth Day" on the first juvenile hunt. All kids are invited, prizes are given, refreshment, etc. etc. Its put on by a local taxidermy/processing shop and I am going to get heavily involved with it next year. It has outgrown the taxidermy shop and they can use the help. I think they had 80 kids this year. I am looking forward to this all ready.

Congrats on the daughters wanting to hunt with you. Thats every hunting daddy's dream I think. And believe me I will not hold my hunting restrictions to my daughter. I will teach QDMA but will without a doubt let her pull the trigger on a small buck on her first hunt if she so chooses. Now when she gets older and takes out a small buck or two I am sure her thinking will probably change. Just like most any other hunters.

Im anxious to see how your girls do. Good luck and enjoy.
 

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I don't believe anyone should need a reason as to why they've shot a Legal Buck.
Immature bucks are just as legal as mature bucks and that's what our youth hunters should be being taught.

I agree to a point. If it wasnt for that dang 8 year old nephew that has killed 2 leagal nubbin head.....

This is hunting, not killing the first thing walking
 

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In my state its get what is offered to you if you want some meat for your family. I agree that conservation should be followed to achieve a better herd , but If I waited for my state to manage a better herd I might as well quit hunting.It will not happen in my life time and I already pay the F&G to asses the herd yearly and if they say its OK to shoot what ever is legal then I should take advantage of it.As for those who wait for an old giant because they say its better management then my hats off to you. As for me I'm well fed and I'm getting my moneys worth out of my already costly license.To wrap it up I'll say to all of those who say that I'm hurting the deer herd by taking out 1 1/2 & 2 1/2 year old bucks put a sock in it because I'm doing what my F&G says I can harvest legally.
 
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every state and situation is different. if there are too many deer them some got to go but i would say do it wisely not just blast everything that walks.

just cause you can do something, doesn't mean you should. some want to be good stewards of the wildlife and some will never get past the yahoo stage. its the yahoos i don't want teaching the youth cause its starting them down the wrong path to being good stewards.
 

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the bottom line is this, If a person shoots a "legal" Deer That's All that should matter.
Nobody should be concerned with whether a Buck OR Doe is a
Mature or Immature Deer so long as it's harvested within the legal means of that States Laws.
 
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the bottom line is this, If a person shoots a "legal" Deer That's All that should matter.
Nobody should be concerned with whether a Buck OR Doe is a
Mature or Immature Deer so long as it's harvested within the legal means of that States Laws.
but is that being a good steward of the wildlife? again, just cause you can doesn't mean you should?
 

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but is that being a good steward of the wildlife? again, just cause you can doesn't mean you should?
Absolutely! Youth hunters who practice Safe, Ethical hunting is all we should strive for.
We "Hunters" are nothing more than the tools used to manage the wildlife, The experts at the federal and state levels guide what and when we can hunt and Up till now they've done very well,,, especially seeing as how the Whitetail deer population here in North America is at it's highest levels ever.
Somebody's doing something right.
 
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i disagree. it isn't necessarily being a good steward.

example, in nh they are trying to build the population of deer. thats why the very limited doe season, 2 days where i live, less in other areas and only on the sea cost where the habitat is shrinking do we have more than a couple, days 7 there i think. we only have that cause to many people would just not hunt, and a loss of revenue. so is filling your tag with a doe being a good steward? no its not. now can i understand why someone would fill their tag with a doe? heck yea i don't hold it against them for doing so but only because it is legal. so this is a case where shooting a immature buck is better than shooting a doe, again each state is different.

i don't care what anyone says "if its brown its down" is wrong, it will always be wrong, and i will never say its the right thing to do. its understandable, but its wrong and wrong headed. it says one has no regard for the wildlife and the future of hunting. it says i'm gettin mine no mater what it is. its selfish. that's the mentality that drove the numbers of deer in this country so low. shoot'um all, thats tradition to the inth. it took laws to try and put a halt to this and have people wake up and realize that more care and thought should be given to hunting, as hunters.

anyway sorry the thread got hi-jacked enjoy the hunt
 

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The thread wasn't hijacked this is the issue the poster was concerned with.
I don't believe anyone but you Ronn has referred to the Brown is down mentality. We're talking about taking Legal Deer, be it Bucks or Does we're not talking about shooting anything that walks BUT if it happens to walk in front of a Licensed Hunter who can Legally tag it, why should they let you decide what they can shoot rather then let their tags decide what they can shoot.
Ronn I totally understand your position and I get just as frustrated here in Vermont as you do in NH,,, and I'd love to be able to call the shots based on what I observe in the woods but each state has experts that determine Where, When & What gets hunted.
I only hunt small portions of Vermont Our state officials are just about BEGGING hunters to shoot more Does a lot of hunters refuse to cooperate in taking Does because they're stuck on their own theories of management.
So now with Vermont being over-run by Does is it wrong for Vermonters to harvest them? No.
You and I ronn may never see ideal hunting in our states EVEN IF by some miracle NH or Vt. became perfectly balanced in a year or 2,,, You and I both know it only takes one Severe winter to get it right back to the way it was. It's not only the hunter harvest that affects the hunting in our region, sometimes It's a compilation of a bunch of things. We can't always blame hunters who harvest Immature bucks or Does for the issues Vt. and NH have to deal with.
 
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good. glad the post didn't get hi-jacked. You are right, try as we might to get the perfect herd here in nh, vt, me, is for not if we get a bad winter. I didn't say i wanted to decide if someone else should take a legal deer or not. I'm saying some thought into why that deer, and because its standing there isn't a good reason. its his/her first deer is a good reason or it may be my only opportunity, or i need to be at work so i got to get something into the freezer. there are tons that could apply. I would like every hunter to think carefully about; first, the animal as a group (management), second, the effects on hunting as a life style, or whatever you want to call it, sport but i don't really care for that term, and then themselves as an individual hunter. It comes down to shooting the right deer, be it a doe or a buck, be it 10 does, the first legal deer or whatever.

passing deer here in nh and in vt is a very hard thing to do. last year i passed on 4 deer with the bow but ended up taking an immature buck one that i had passed earlier. why? time was running out and if i remember right that was the last deer i saw until late bow season. it comes back to another post i posted. I think more thought needs to be put into hunting by hunters so that we are not thought of as just murderous neanderthals just blood hungry by those that don't understand hunting. and shooting any legal deer is the definition of if its brown its down. if its an illegal deer that another can of worms.
 

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I was commenting on what brucebruce1959 had posted. I believe that we all ,or perhaps some of us have shot many smaller deer in the past to either put some experience under our belts or to feed our families. The only one we answer to is ourselves,so get out of it what you need or want .Its one thing to preach , but the proof is in the pudding.
 
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thanks. I wasn't preaching just putting out food for thought. I've shot little deer, button bucks, nice bucks, and does. only one was a "i didn't mean to take that deer".

Believe me I know how hard it is to take any deer in nh not to mention a big ole buck. even with the "preaching" i'm a "if you are happy with the deer you shot, and you must be you shot it, i'm happy for you". The first legal deer would be down for me if I hadn't taken a couple in pa. I know not everyone can go to where there are lots of deer. now, i will pass a doe with the bow and it would have to be a good buck for me to take it with the rifle but only cause i got some in the freezer. if it were empty thats another story. really i'm trying to beat anyone up. if its a legal deer and you are happy, i'm happy. its the bigger picture i guess i see now, after 40 years deer hunting, rather than years ago, and my goals, i'm sure, are different than the next guy's. the four stages isn't something i made up, its a know fact after looking at the goals of long time hunters all over the country. I'm not perfect and things don't always go the way i would like. most times i settle with what i given when it comes to deer hunting, but i strive to do better, be better, learn more, and do whats best. by bringing up shoot the right deer for the right reason i hope that it gets others to thinking about why they shoot what they shoot, regardless of what it is. does that make any sense?
 

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Sheesh... I leave for what, an hour?? And then all the action starts!!

What im getting out of this is "if its legal and you want to shoot it then shoot it."

And the only difference im getting out of ronn's is "if its legal and your gonna shoot it then have a good reason to shoot it." Have some kind of thought process (reason) in your head on why you took this particular deer. Dont go in the woods blasting away. Take a legal deer but dont kill it just to kill it.

Am I correct?
 
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