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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 12-22-2007, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by BruceBruce1959 View Post
BUT for the life of me I don't know why anyone would pay to hunt Deer that way.
Folks with more money than I got that dont want the satisfaction of putting a little scout time in to fill their tags.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 12-22-2007, 10:30 AM
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Onehorse, If the hunters are paying to hunt on lands where the Deer are living freely without fences and NOT being fed, then yes I would say any one of those deer from those areas should be allowed, BUT for the life of me I don't know why anyone would pay to hunt Deer that way.
I agree with you on that, Bruce. I lean toward the idea that lots of guys just want to impress people with their so-called skills at hunting, so they pay folks to do most of the work. If they can afford it, so be it. It's legal, even if the ethics are questionable. And as for the Record Book, who cares anyway! The only people who look at that are the guys who put the stats in it. It's just too bad that so much of this is going on these days, that it results in lots of great hunting land being locked up by outfitters who are leasing. That just hurts the average hunter who may have a hard time finding a place to hunt. Anyway, next season I'll hold off shooting those little 15 inch 4x4s so I can show you what good genetics and food can produce in this part of the country ... without steroids, etc.
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Old 12-23-2007, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by BruceBruce1959 View Post
Onehorse, If the hunters are paying to hunt on lands where the Deer are living freely without fences and NOT being fed, then yes I would say any one of those deer from those areas should be allowed, BUT for the life of me I don't know why anyone would pay to hunt Deer that way.
Bruce, I just re-read one of my favorite books about hunter ethics, Beyond Fair Chase, by Jim Posewitz. In his chapter about trophy hunting he says that unless the animal is availble to everyone - NOT in an area that's reserved for priveliged (paying) hunters, the animal should not be considered a trophy. I guess he believes that even if there are no high fences or artcificial antler growth supplements (including feed plots for the purpose of attracting deer), everyone needs to have a fair chance to harvest the animal before anyone can claim it as a trophy. Makes sense to me. What do you think?
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Old 12-23-2007, 11:30 AM
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Beyond Fair Chase, by Jim Posewitz. In his chapter about trophy hunting he says that unless the animal is availble to everyone - NOT in an area that's reserved for priveliged (paying) hunters, the animal should not be considered a trophy.
Oh well now there's a Great Description of Fair Chase. And It's SO true that some hunters can afford to pay for hunts while many others cannot. another way fair chase should be viewed, By affordability...

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Old 12-23-2007, 02:22 PM
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Bruce, I just re-read one of my favorite books about hunter ethics, Beyond Fair Chase, by Jim Posewitz. In his chapter about trophy hunting he says that unless the animal is availble to everyone - NOT in an area that's reserved for priveliged (paying) hunters, the animal should not be considered a trophy. I guess he believes that even if there are no high fences or artcificial antler growth supplements (including feed plots for the purpose of attracting deer), everyone needs to have a fair chance to harvest the animal before anyone can claim it as a trophy. Makes sense to me. What do you think?
i like that concept
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Old 12-23-2007, 03:20 PM
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This has been a great topic, so I will join in. Official trophies should be fair chase only. I don't believe that a 20,000 acre Texas ranch would not be considered fair chase, fences or no fences. In Ohio or PA where I hunt 100 acres might be a large tract of property. Everyone has a desicion to make regarding what rules they will hunt/live by. Having the oppertunity to enjoy open range expensive hunts where the outfitter does everything except pull the trigger is still a hunt for someone. All animals submitted for BC&PY should be put into a catagory relating to how it was taken. The famous Hole in the Horn buck should be submitted as a found deer and be ranked in that section. Fenced in deer then should be put into their section of the records. You will never get everyone to be honest or play by the rules. Hunters must look in the mirror and examine ourselves to see where we fall in the great game of life, how do we rank ourselves in the fair chase of the great outdoors. This may be a bit off the subject but ethics is a major problem today and needs cleaned up by teaching the youth the right ways of life and as hunters. Maybe then some of these issues would be looked upon in a different light. Happy Holidays to all!!!
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 12-23-2007, 05:17 PM
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You seem like a guy who really understands the meaning of ethics. In a sense, it has a lot to do with what a hunter should see in the mirror when he or she walks by it... not what other people see when they look at the hunter. After all, they may think they are looking at a great hunter, while the hunter only sees the reflection of someone who has cheated, misrepresented, and shown disrespect for the animal. Please look at my recommended read, Beyond Fair Chase, (described in the Lodge on this site). It should be REQUIRED reading for everyone who takes a Hunter/Firearm Safety course.
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 12-28-2007, 10:45 PM
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All of these posts are great but now I feel kind of bad because I do hunt over corn feeders and Im going to be hunting on that Highfence I loved hunting fair chase but well I dont really have the money to join a lease and Im not really a meat hunter but im not a trophy hunter either I dont shoot the small bucks Ill shoot 8 points and up cause I want to give the deer a chance to grow but I will shoot does if we are out of venison and Ill shoot the little stub spikes cause they wont get much big so um should I feel bad cause i feel like im hunting against everyones oppinions please tell me if its ok or not thanks
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