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post #21 of 49 (permalink) Old 11-28-2008, 07:15 PM
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when i was at the academy we had no such saying. i wasn't trying to be demeaning saying "cop" mostly nothing but respect for folks in "law enforcement" but his record is clear and gun bans don't work. they haven't worked in dc or Baltimore for 30 years.

oh, most of those same voters are fascinated by Paris Hilton and small shiny objects as well.

Last edited by ronn; 11-28-2008 at 08:01 PM. Reason: wrong word
post #22 of 49 (permalink) Old 11-28-2008, 07:45 PM
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nogods, this is what i found online:
Barack Obama on Gun Control

Democratic nomine for President; Junior Senator (IL)

Ok for states & cities to determine local gun laws

Q: Is the D.C. law prohibiting ownership of handguns consistent with an individual's right to bear arms?

A: As a general principle, I believe that the Constitution confers an individual right to bear arms. But just because you have an individual right does not mean that the state or local government can't constrain the exercise of that right, in the same way that we have a right to private property but local governments can establish zoning ordinances that determine how you can use it.
Q: But do you still favor the registration & licensing of guns?
A: I think we can provide common-sense approaches to the issue of illegal guns that are ending up on the streets. We can make sure that criminals don't have guns in their hands. We can make certain that those who are mentally deranged are not getting a hold of handguns. We can trace guns that have been used in crimes to unscrupulous gun dealers that may be selling to straw purchasers and dumping them on the streets. Source: 2008 Philadelphia primary debate, on eve of PA primary Apr 16, 2008
FactCheck: Yes, Obama endorsed Illinois handgun ban

Obama was being misleading when he denied that his handwriting had been on a document endorsing a state ban on the sale and possession of handguns in Illinois. Obama responded, "No, my writing wasn't on that particular questionnaire. As I said, I have never favored an all-out ban on handguns."

Actually, Obama's writing was on the 1996 document, which was filed when Obama was running for the Illinois state Senate. A Chicago nonprofit, Independent Voters of Illinois, had this question, and Obama took hard line:
35. Do you support state legislation to:
a. ban the manufacture, sale and possession of handguns? Yes.
b. ban assault weapons? Yes.
c. mandatory waiting periods and background checks? Yes.
Obama's campaign said, "Sen. Obama didn't fill out these state Senate questionnaires--a staffer did--and there are several answers that didn't reflect his views then or now. He may have jotted some notes on the front page of the questionnaire, but some answers didn't reflect his views." Source: FactCheck.org analysis of 2008 Philadelphia primary debate Apr 16, 2008
Respect 2nd Amendment, but local gun bans ok

Q: You said recently, "I have no intention of taking away folks' guns." But you support the D.C. handgun ban, and you've said that it's constitutional. How do you reconcile those two positions?

A: Because I think we have two conflicting traditions in this country. I think it's important for us to recognize that we've got a tradition of handgun ownership and gun ownership generally. And a lot of law-abiding citizens use it for hunting, for sportsmanship, and for protecting their families. We also have a violence on the streets that is the result of illegal handgun usage. And so I think there is nothing wrong with a community saying we are going to take those illegal handguns off the streets. And cracking down on the various loopholes that exist in terms of background checks for children, the mentally ill. We can have reasonable, thoughtful gun control measure that I think respect the Second Amendment and people's traditions. Source: 2008 Politico pre-Potomac Primary interview Feb 11, 2008
Provide some common-sense enforcement on gun licensing

Q: When you were in the state senate, you talked about licensing and registering gun owners. Would you do that as president?

A: I don't think that we can get that done. But what we can do is to provide just some common-sense enforcement. The efforts by law enforcement to obtain the information required to trace back guns that have been used in crimes to unscrupulous gun dealers. As president, I intend to make it happen. We essentially have two realities, when it comes to guns, in this country. You've got the tradition of lawful gun ownership. It is very important for many Americans to be able to hunt, fish, take their kids out, teach them how to shoot. Then you've got the reality of 34 Chicago public school students who get shot down on the streets of Chicago. We can reconcile those two realities by making sure the Second Amendment is respected and that people are able to lawfully own guns, but that we also start cracking down on the kinds of abuses of firearms that we see on the streets. Source: 2008 Democratic debate in Las Vegas Jan 15, 2008
2000: cosponsored bill to limit purchases to 1 gun per month

Obama sought moderate gun control measures, such as a 2000 bill he cosponsored to limit handgun purchases to one per month (it did not pass). He voted against letting people violate local weapons bans in cases of self-defense, but also voted in2004 to let retired police officers carry concealed handguns.
Source: The Improbable Quest, by John K. Wilson, p.148 Oct 30, 2007
Concealed carry OK for retired police officers

Obama voted for a bill in the Illinois senate that allowed retired law enforcement officers to carry concealed weapons. If there was any issue on which Obama rarely deviated, it was gun control. He was the most strident candidate when it came to enforcin and expanding gun control laws. So this vote jumped out as inconsistent.

When I queried him about the vote, he said, "I didn't find that [vote] surprising. I am consistently on record and will continue to be on record as opposing concealed carry. This was a narrow exception in an exceptional circumstance where a retired police officer might find himself vulnerable as a consequence of the work he has previously done--and had been trained extensively in the proper use of firearms."
It wasn't until a few weeks later that another theory came forward about the uncharacteristic vote. Obama was battling with his GOP opponent to win the endorsement of the Fraternal Order of Police. Source: From Promise to Power, by David Mendell, p.250-251 Aug 14, 2007
Stop unscrupulous gun dealers dumping guns in cities

Q: How would you address gun violence that continues to be the #1 cause of death among African-American men?

A: You know, when the massacre happened at Virginia Tech, I think all of us were grief stricken and shocked by the carnage. But in this year alone, in Chicago, we've had 34 Chicago public school students gunned down and killed. And for the most part, there has been silence. We know what to do. We've got to enforce the gun laws that are on the books. We've got to make sure that unscrupulous gun dealers aren't loading up vans and dumping guns in our communities, because we know they're not made in our communities. There aren't any gun manufacturers here, right here in the middle of Detroit. But what we also have to do is to make sure that we change our politics so that we care just as much about those 30-some children in Chicago who've been shot as we do the children in Virginia Tech. That's a mindset that we have to have in the White House and we don't have it right now. Source: 2007 NAACP Presidential Primary Forum Jul 12, 2007
Keep guns out of inner cities--but also problem of morality

I believe in keeping guns out of our inner cities, and that our leaders must say so in the face of the gun manfuacturer's lobby. But I also believe that when a gangbanger shoots indiscriminately into a crowd because he feels someone disrespected him, we have a problem of morality. Not only do ew need to punish thatman for his crime, but we need to acknowledge that there's a hole in his heart, one that government programs alone may not be able to repair.
Source: The Audacity of Hope, by Barack Obama, p.215 Oct 1, 2006
Bush erred in failing to renew assault weapons ban

KEYES: [to Obama]: I am a strong believer in the second amendment. The gun control mentality is ruthlessly absurd. It suggests that we should pass a law that prevents law abiding citizens from carrying weapons. You end up with a situation where the crook have all the guns and the law abiding citizens cannot defend themselves. I guess that's good enough for Senator Obama who voted against the bill that would have allowed homeowners to defend themselves if their homes were broken into.

OBAMA: Let's be honest. Mr. Keyes does not believe in common gun control measures like the assault weapons bill. Mr. Keyes does not believe in any limits from what I can tell with respect to the possession of guns, including assault weapons that have only one purpose, to kill people. I think it is a scandal that this president did not authorize a renewal of the assault weapons ban. Source: Illinois Senate Debate #3: Barack Obama vs. Alan Keyes Oct 21, 2004

Last edited by ronn; 11-28-2008 at 07:47 PM.
post #23 of 49 (permalink) Old 11-28-2008, 07:46 PM
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Ban semi-automatics, and more possession restrictions

  • Principles that Obama supports on gun issues:
  • Ban the sale or transfer of all forms of semi-automatic weapons.
  • Increase state restrictions on the purchase and possession of firearms.
  • Require manufacturers to provide child-safety locks with firearms.
Source: 1998 IL State Legislative National Political Awareness Test Jul 2, 1998
Voted NO on prohibiting lawsuits against gun manufacturers.

A bill to prohibit civil liability actions from being brought or continued against manufacturers, distributors, dealers, or importers of firearms or ammunition for damages, injunctive or other relief resulting from the misuse of their products by others. Voting YES would:
  • Exempt lawsuits brought against individuals who knowingly transfer a firearm that will be used to commit a violent or drug-trafficking crime
  • Exempt lawsuits against actions that result in death, physical injury or property damage due solely to a product defect
  • Call for the dismissal of all qualified civil liability actions pending on the date of enactment by the court in which the action was brought
  • Prohibit the manufacture, import, sale or delivery of armor piercing ammunition, and sets a minimum prison term of 15 years for violations
  • Require all licensed importers, manufacturers and dealers who engage in the transfer of handguns to provide secure gun storage or safety devices
Reference: Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act; Bill S 397 ; vote number 2005-219 on Jul 29, 2005
post #24 of 49 (permalink) Old 11-28-2008, 07:50 PM
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If thats not anti, what is?
post #25 of 49 (permalink) Old 11-28-2008, 08:12 PM
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Actually the majority voted AGAINST him. 57% --It was the electoral numbers that put him in. Guns do not kill people. The criminal with his finger on the trigger does. It is the judicial system that needs to be revamped not the gun control laws. You being an officer above all should know that. We the ethical gun owners should not be penalized because the judicial system can not place or keep criminals in jail where they belong.
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post #26 of 49 (permalink) Old 11-28-2008, 08:46 PM
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I'm pretty sure he got both the pop and the electoral.

The silly thing is with that, what you said wmi, is that the same left that want gun bans, want to turn the dirt bags back on the streets because being in jail is against their civil liberties or now he has an education, say thank you to everyone paying taxes, so he's not a threat any longer. yeah right now he's just a more educated rapist, murder, drug dealer and back on the street.

There was a study done a few years ago on crime and guns. In this study they interviewed career criminals. what the interviewers found was the criminals weren't afraid of the police, they weren't afraid of jail, what they were afraid of was Joe homeowner with a fully loaded glock 30, or the like, meeting them at the window.

Last edited by ronn; 11-28-2008 at 09:09 PM.
post #27 of 49 (permalink) Old 11-28-2008, 09:52 PM
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Obama's stance on gun control is not what has been depicted by the NRA. Yes, he does want to impose restrictions on the types of weapons that can be legally owned, but none of his proposals address any traditional guns used for hunting.
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post #28 of 49 (permalink) Old 11-29-2008, 12:10 AM
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Just wanted to say that my comments were directed to nogods.who appears to be completely misinformed.i don't mean any disrespect to anyone.it just pi--es me off for someone to agree with obama on gun control.
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post #29 of 49 (permalink) Old 11-29-2008, 06:22 AM
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Its a shame that many in the law inforcement mostly the ones sitting behind fat desks believe in gun restriction. They fear an armed sociaty and want nothing more than to ban private gun ownership period. The posts by the retired officer is way out of line and does not represent mainstream America. Liberal America is the problem, bad things are going to happen. To what extent who knows. At some point, there's going to be a collision what side will you be on? Our wallets will be on auomatic control, with washington at the helm. If your firearms are registered they will at some point come knocking. Bush took the wind out of America's sails, Obama is going to tax the wind out of you and give it to the less fortunate.
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post #30 of 49 (permalink) Old 11-29-2008, 07:57 AM
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you know the problem with the bans on firearms is that the law abidding citizans will turn over there guns but the criminal wont because most or all responcibof there guns are not registered so what we will have are people that cant defend thereselves where is the concern for those folks we all know that there isn't enough law enforcement to protect every one and the point about retierd officers aloud to carry a conceled weapon because of there past job for there own protection seems to me as a double standerd there are people who may have testified against someone should be able to protect there selves also and what about past military members can they protect ther selves they also have demenstraited responsibility to bare arms where do all these citizans fit in there new laws
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